Dad29: Another $1 Million in Capitol Security?

Wednesday, August 17, 2011

Another $1 Million in Capitol Security?

Well, well.

We note that "Day of Rage" (9/17) has a Capitol Protest lined up for Wisconsin.

Goodie.

HT: Zippers

31 comments:

Anonymous said...: "Remember to close your fist before striking.
Warm up those batons and water cannons!
5 minutes to disperse. Live ammo."

Whenever Dad29 links to Zippers, and I happen to read those types of statements by such enlightened commenters, I don't know whether to laugh or cry!

I venture to say that we ought to have a law that ensures only "proper" protests for the "right" reasons to occur. Perhaps Robin Vos could take the lead in the Wisconsin Legislature regardless if that damn First Amendment right for citizens to assemble is in the way!

Or maybe Walker can make a special guest appearance on 9/17 and reassure the crowd that he is honest (like Obama???) for his calls for bi-partisanship!; 8/17/2011 4:05 PM
TerryN said...: Cost of Capitol security to protect legislators from unruly mobs:

$2M and counting.

Cost to repair the damage to the Capitol from unruly mobs.

$2M and counting

Cost for the national unions to attempt to flip the legislature:

Priceless; 8/17/2011 9:12 PM
Jim said...: Come on, Mom. Estimates for repairs to the capitol are about $270,000, not $2,000,000.; 8/17/2011 9:39 PM
Anonymous said...: Jim's right. It was only 270K plus 7.6 Mill for security for the limp wrist-ed, 60's throwback, un-showered, indoctrinated, socialist SOB, drum thumpin' pieces of crap.; 8/17/2011 10:21 PM
Jim said...: So people don't have a right to peaceably assemble and protest if it costs too much?

Guess it's OK if you are wearing a tri-corner hat, waving a snake flag and carrying a strap-on (weapon) on your hip.

Nony sounds like one of those hard-hap types in the 60s who loved to beat the crap out of the dirty hippies. (and proud of it, I'm sure).; 8/17/2011 11:31 PM
Amy said...: So people don't have a right to peaceably assemble and protest if it costs too much?

Key word there is "peaceably"...threatening to kill Republican legislators and inhibit the work of government is not PEACEABLY protesting.

Hence the security.; 8/18/2011 5:57 AM
Dad29 said...: http://www.channel3000.com/politics/28822971/detail.html

It's $8.1 million for the cops (and fake cops called Capitol Police) plus a few hundred thou for building damages.

The cops were brought in specifically because the crowds were not "peaceable." Maybe in California death-threats and promises to 'hurt your family' are "peaceable."

But then, California is about to become de-populated.; 8/18/2011 6:31 AM
Anonymous said...: Indeed, the key word is peaceable. How many people in the crowd had criminal records for committing a violent act? How many arrests in Madison for violent actions, like burning cars and buildings? Any calls to the National Guard? Oh my God, the protestors made vile remarks, they should be hung! /sarcasm

In any protest group, even among Tea Partiers (gasp!), you will have your hoodlums and troublemakers. The solution? The police are present to carefully monitor the situation.

"8.1 million for the cops..."

Perhaps Walker should get his cronies to pass a bill reducing their overtime pay, or actually get them and the firefighters, like ALL public employees, to pay for their health insurance and benefits.

And since when did the Founding Fathers ever say that protests ought to be "inexpensive", or that demonstrations must fall within a budget, for people to exercise their First Amendment rights? The British used that same argument that the colonists were wasting precious financial resources for silly" demonstrations.

Moreover, Dad29, if you are so concerned about "death threats" and "promises to hurt [one's] family", where is your outrage regarding the comments made on your precious Weasel Zippers website?; 8/18/2011 10:54 AM
Dad29 said...: How many people in the crowd had criminal records for committing a violent act? How many arrests in Madison for violent actions, like burning cars and buildings? Any calls to the National Guard?

You specialize in irrelevant questions just like Foust. He's banned.

Since you seem to have the time to read comboxes, you can respond. Good for you!

By the way, reporting the near-$10 million cost of keeping the rabble under control is NOT the same as suggesting that the rabble doesn't have 1A rights--except in some fevered minds.

The shoe fits. Put it on. And drink plenty of water for your fever.; 8/18/2011 11:01 AM
Anonymous said...: Irrelevant questions? Only a partisan would make that claim if he/she is unwilling or unprepared to answer them.

"By the way, reporting the near-$10 million cost of keeping the rabble under control is NOT the same as suggesting that the rabble doesn't have 1A rights--except in some fevered minds."

Sure, the demonstrators have rights they can exercise, but the protests should not take place, or at the very least be significantly curtailed, because of the costs involved. That is the implication you and Amy are making.

Where is the "imminent, persistent" danger that would necessitate, in essence, closing or severely limiting access the Capitol Building to taxpayers?

But, but, but, those "outside agitators" that are being bused in, they are not Wisconsinites? Hey, cry me a river. Both sides bring in their boyzzz and girlzzz to the show. Freedom to travel, freedom to protest where is the action.

Again, since when does exercising one's rights have a financial tag to it? The Founding Fathers certainly rallied behind the phrase "Freedom isn't and never will be free, there is a price to pay". The local authorities get paid to do their job, so let them do it.; 8/18/2011 12:57 PM
Dad29 said...: Where is the "imminent, persistent" danger that would necessitate, in essence, closing or severely limiting access the Capitol Building to taxpayers?

What we on the 'outside' know is not necessarily all the information that Capitol officials know. They would be fools to tell us, too.

Foust.; 8/18/2011 2:55 PM
Anonymous said...: "Imminent, persistent" danger = Foust?

That's a knee slapper, Dad29. Wasn't there a deranged anony who repeatedly expressed how he wished that Foust would be sodomized and that his son had contracted AIDS? Classy, aina?

Foust might be a pain, but he's no where near the mental midget status of one of your guests.

And Capitol officials have informed the public about what they know. Transparency, yes!

www.jsonline.com/news/statepolitics/121721234.html; 8/18/2011 3:34 PM
neomom said...: Um... Not sure anyone can sit there and angelically claim of "peaceful" protests when the name of the protest is .. ahem... "Day of Rage"; 8/18/2011 7:07 PM
Amy said...: How many people in the crowd had criminal records for committing a violent act?

Oh, what a load of tosh. Doesn't matter what prior criminal convictions were, everyone knows the tone of the protests was not peaceful, it was angry and disruptive.

The unions have shown, with their harassment of those smart enough not to share the union views, they'll resort to violence.

It wasn't a TEA Party protester who shot a non-union business owner. It was a left-wing union member.; 8/18/2011 8:44 PM
TerryN said...: Well the little angels were more peaceable then their brethren in Ohio.

Union organizer suspected of shooting non-union Ohio employer

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2011/08/17/union-organizer-suspected-of-shooting-non-union-ohio-employer/#ixzz1VRREAhGz

I'm sure he's got an alibi.; 8/18/2011 10:24 PM
Anonymous said...: Was it a Tea Party afficionado who killed the abortion doctor in Kansas? Or was it a religious kook?; 8/18/2011 11:03 PM
Anonymous said...: OMG, TerryN, some wacko shot a man. And the person who committed the cowardly act was a union member. Ergo, let's label all labor groups as promoters of violence.

Awesome use of your powers of deduction /sarcasm

Interesting how some conservatives have a conniption fit when the opposition puts labels to their words and generalizes their behavior, but seem to have no problem engaging in that same type of conduct themselves. It's called confirmation bias, TerryN.

"...everyone knows the tone of the protests was not peaceful, it was angry and disruptive."

What, Amy, are we five with the "everyone knows" argument? Let's stay on point. It is clear that you have certain criteria as to what protests constitute as "legitimate". The litmus test? Whether the "tone" is not "angry" or "disruptive". Dad29 promotes that sort of "tone" with his "buy more ammo" mantra. And some people buy into it with devastating consequences (see below).**

Wait a minute, I forgot...unions use "inciting words", Tea Partiers use "passionate language".

**"Get on Target for Victory in November. Help remove Gabrielle Giffords from office. Shoot a fully automatic M16 with Jesse Kelly."

Hmmm, this "tone" certainly has a particular implication. From a June 2010 Tea Party Rally led by Jesse King, who ran against Democratic Representative Gabrielle Gifford. Now, some would argue that as a result of that "tone", it would encourage a lunatic to shoot innocent people, just like what happened in Tuscon, with Gifford taking a bullet to frickin' head.

Allyson Miller, a leader of a Tucson-area tea party group, quickly condemned the mass shooting (just like labor leaders when their brethren commit similar acts).

She stated emphatically, however, that this incident will not mean her group will tone down their rhetoric: "I think anytime you start suppressing freedom of speech, I think it's wrong. I live here and I didn't hear anything [in the 2010 campaign] that concerned me in terms of inciting violence."

So, Miller doesn't seem to have a problem with the "tone". Fantastic. So I'm sure she would have no problems with such phrases, whether coming from a LEFTY or RIGHTY, to ""Remember to close your fist before striking", "Warm up those batons and water cannons!", and "5 minutes to disperse. Live ammo."

Yet, Amy and TerryN beg to differ in the case with DA UNIONS because there is a clear distinction between the rhetoric of the right and the left. Because, after all, unions use "inciting words" , and Tea Partiers use "passionate language".; 8/18/2011 11:57 PM
Amy said...: Was it a Tea Party afficionado who killed the abortion doctor in Kansas? Or was it a religious kook?

Just a kook. Long before the TEA Party was an idea. Whereas the union shooter was, oh, less than a week ago.

Yet, Amy and TerryN beg to differ in the case with DA UNIONS because there is a clear distinction between the rhetoric of the right and the left. Because, after all, unions use "inciting words" , and Tea Partiers use "passionate language".

No, because there are far more union members/lefties that believe protests and violence are synonymous. The G8 "protests" and the recent London riots show that. While I freely admit the TEA Party probably has a few kooks in it as well, a majority of the acts of political violence carried out around the globe, and in the US, are done by left and left-center groups backing liberal causes.

There have not been nearly as many physical altercations at TEA Party rallies as with these union protests. It would have been news and you both know it.

And TEA Party members clean up after themselves, too. Had we protested in the Capitol, there wouldn't be the need for even $200k in cleaning costs.; 8/19/2011 5:00 AM
neomom said...: Anony is trying to push that the Tea Party is responsible for the Giffords shooting again?

Nothing like ignoring that the shooter was an undiagnosed schizophrenic who had had her on his mind for quite some time before the incident and that, if he had any political philosophy, per friends, it was left-leaning.

I'm sure that the union members and organizers that have been vandalizing and harassing that small business owner in Toledo for years before shooting him last week can all claim mental illness. (sarc)

Just don't call unions thugs, they don't like that.; 8/19/2011 5:52 AM
Anonymous said...: neomom--"Anony is trying to push that the Tea Party is responsible for the Giffords shooting again?"

Thanks for taking the bait. I never made that point specifically, nor did I imply it in my post. A loon is a loon is a loon. YOU are the one trying to cast blame on the sicko's alleged political ideology as a factor for him committing that crime. Sad!

Amy--"No, because there are far more union members/lefties that believe protests and violence are synonymous. The G8 "protests" and the recent London riots show that...a majority of the acts of political violence carried out around the globe, and in the US, are done by left and left-center groups backing liberal causes.

Another broad generalization based on confirmation bias. Just type in "rightist protests throughout world" on Google and you will read a plethora of right-wing protests which have been underscored by violence.

Say it with me now, Amy and Neomom...a loon is a loon is a loon. One's political ideology does NOT mean they are prone to committing violence because of their affiliation. There are a host of factors as to why people, left or right, decide to take matters into their own hands when protesting. Yet you both seem willing to do everything within your might to blame one particular group. Confirmation bias, indeed.; 8/19/2011 9:34 AM
neomom said...: If a loon is a loon, then the unions are chock-full of them. But just don't call them thugs right?

Verizon has had at least 220 incidences of sabotage since August 6 - before the strike was called. The union also had to take down a recording from their site where a union leader called for the membership to "torture" manager and non-union members with taunts and noise until the "wished they hadn't gotten out of bed that morning".

As far as the non-union electrical business owner who was shot... This wasn't some lone loon or a one-time occurrence. Man this guy sounds absolutely evil doesn't he? Employing 25 people that aren't unionized. The Horrors!!!!

"With around 25 employees, John King owns one of the largest non-union electrical contracting businesses in the Toledo, Ohio area. As a non-union contractor, his business happens to be doing well at a time when unions in the construction industry are suffering. This, it seems, has made the usual animosity unions have for him even greater, making him a prime target of union thugs. So much so, that one of them tried to kill him last week at his home.

John King didn’t plan on being an enemy of unions. In fact, he says all he’s ever wanted to do is work at something he loves doing and be successful at it—something that most normal Americans would call ‘The American Dream.’

After high school and some college, Mr. King briefly worked for an IBEW contractor before being drafted into the military. Following his service in the early 70s, King became his own boss by going into business as the youngest electrical contractor in Toledo....; 8/20/2011 8:18 AM
neomom said...: con't...

"Over the years, King Electrical Services had always been a small business. However, during the Great Recession, King’s business has actually improved as his union competitors have priced themselves out of work.

Unfortunately, being a non-union electrical company, King has always been on the radar of the International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers (IBEW). In fact, in 2006, he won a significant case against the IBEW at the US Court of Appeals, after the union had improperly promised his electricians jobs on union sites if they voted the union into King’s company.

Since he’s been in business, in addition to the legal battles and verbal abuse, King’s company has been vandalized and threatened on numerous occasions.

“Back then, it was nothing to have to regularly buy a new set of tires.” King said during a telephone interview on Tuesday. “The ice pick was the weapon of choice.”

Until Wednesday, the worst of the union attacks on King and his business came in the mid-eighties during the UAW strike at AP Parts. During a lull during the lengthy strike, King’s business was picketed by more than 50 IBEW picketers. This was at a time when he only had eight or nine employees. One of his employees, whose car was trashed by the union picketers, was also beaten up by IBEW thugs.

Unfortunately, the vandalism has never stopped. This year alone, he’s had to report three incidents of damage to police. This doesn’t include the incidents of stalking he and his men have to go through while they’re working.

In one incident earlier this year, rocks were thrown through the front windows of his shop, one of which had the word “kill” written on it.

Last Wednesday, however, the attacks on Mr. King became much more serious when he was awakened late in the evening at his home in Monroe County, Michigan and saw that the motion lights in his driveway had come on. When he looked out his front window, he saw a figure near his SUV and went outside.

As soon as he got outside his front door, King yelled at the individual who was crouched down by King’s vehicle. As soon as King yelled, the suspect stood and, without hesitation, fired a shot at Mr. King.

Luckily for King, as he yelled, he also stumbled. If it weren’t for that, however, John King’s injuries might have been much, much worse. In fact, he might have been killed.

Upon scrambling back into his house, King got to his cell phone and called 911. However, due to the pain in his knees and shoulder from falling, King was unaware that he had been shot in the arm.

At first, King thought that his assailant was merely trying to break into his vehicle. Little did he know, however, that the perpetrator was targeting him–because of his non-union company.

The night of the shooting, police recovered a shell casing from a small caliber handgun. In addition to the shell casing, police also found a Swiss Army knife that police say was likely going to be used to slice the tires on King’s SUV.

While neither the police, nor Mr. King can say which union was behind the attack, it is very clear by the word ‘scab’ scrawled on his SUV that it the attack was union-related." (via LaborUnionReport); 8/20/2011 8:19 AM
Anonymous said...: neo-mom--If a loon is a loon, then the unions are chock-full of them.

Sigh...some people just never learn, or refuse to admit, when their prejudice colors their judgment entirely. You want to continue to promote the false generalization that unions = thugs, be my guest.

All you did was post an article I had read earlier that described SOME, I repeat SOME, members of a group that is completely in the wrong. As if this story alone "proves" your point.

"Remember to close your fist before striking.
Warm up those batons and water cannons!
5 minutes to disperse. Live ammo."

Only words, right, neomom?; 8/20/2011 9:07 AM
neomom said...: Ah - but all you have are words Anony. We have actual events. Lots of them. The unions are dinosaurs and they are getting increasingly aggressive to try to maintain their power and influence with the government.

When you can find evidence that those supporting the Tea Party over the past 2 years or so have engaged in violent acts have at it.

But your own biases are clouding your view that there are hundreds of incidences in the past 24 month of union members doing it. Take the the vow of the head of the UAW to engage in a "global campaign to brand that company a human-rights violator" if they fail to unionize one of the many foreign auto manufacturers in the south this year. Even though they are faced with workers saying things like this:

“I don’t see any problems here. I don’t see how they could help me out,” said Long, who’s worked at the Hyundai Motor Co. (005380) assembly plant in Montgomery, Alabama, for five years. Of the union representatives who came to his home this year, he said, “I really didn’t give them the time of the day.”

or this

Wanda Carter, a Hyundai hourly worker, said she doesn’t see a need for a union at the Alabama plant.
“Hyundai does the best they can do to work with the Hyundai employees,”

(via Bloomberg); 8/20/2011 9:38 AM
Dad29 said...: Hyundai (and others) prove the converse of the IR Golden Rule: "You get the Union you deserve."

Yes, entities with aggressive and, ahhhh.....behavior-problematic Unions are getting what they deserve (by and large.)

Their management sucks.

By the way, one example of that in Wisconsin was AMC/Kenosha--run by Mitt Romney's daddy.

It's no surprise that there is a teachers' union, either: MPS is certainly not a model of management, and damn few school principals are, either.

That doesn't justify Da Yooonion's position in many instances, of course; but it is telling.; 8/20/2011 10:05 AM
Anonymous said...: Amazing how you all try to pin everything on unions, without even looking at your own backyard. When business owners and management are unwilling to include their workers in the process, history tells us that there will be unrest. Some of which will be peaceful, and other times it will be violent.

And think about when a particular group is being targeted, rather than the group doing the targeting? Naturally, there is going to be a REACTION.

So SOME people are using Dad29's mantra "Buy More Ammo", and what does he, neomom, Amy (where is she by the way?), etc. do? Bitterly detest how that message is being implemented by some within the ranks of DA UNIONS! Understandably, but not justifiably, when a person's livelihood is being threatened or taken away, damn straight some will react "aggressively" with rhetoric and actions.

It is clear that you all have forgotten your history, for when management (i.e. heads of school districts, CEO's, small business owners) have been able to solely determine wages, benefits, work rules, etc. without employee input, by severely curtailing their ability to challenge what the "market" dictates, or by undermining capitalism by pitting "us" versus "them" (closed shop versus open shop), there will be an increase in protests, some of which will be "aggressive:". Again, that fits the Dad29 mantra, so you have no leg to stand on when people put into motion your words. I don't condone it, but that is how society operates today.

"When you can find evidence that those supporting the Tea Party over the past 2 years or so have engaged in violent acts have at it."

Let's stay on point. Rightist groups are just as likely as leftist groups to commit acts of violence, especially if they are or perceive to be in the cross hairs. Again, Google "tea party protest violence" and there is enough out there to suggest that SOME among their ranks are willing to use fists and bats to get their point across. Look very closely, neomom, with your eyes OPEN. I can't help it that you are too caught up in your position to even acknowledge that fact.; 8/20/2011 11:47 AM
Anonymous said...: One more time, Allyson Miller...

She stated emphatically, however, that this incident will not mean her group will tone down their rhetoric: "I think anytime you start suppressing freedom of speech, I think it's wrong. I live here and I didn't hear anything [in the 2010 campaign] that concerned me in terms of inciting violence."

So, Miller doesn't seem to have a problem with the "tone". Fantastic. So I'm sure she would have no problems with such phrases, whether coming from a LEFTY or RIGHTY, to ""Remember to close your fist before striking", "Warm up those batons and water cannons!", and "5 minutes to disperse. Live ammo."

Then be careful what you wish for, because some will go off the deep end and put into motion those words. And some Tea Partiers are just itching for a fight as well. Again, doesn't make it right, but that is how *&&% up is our society.; 8/20/2011 11:53 AM
Anonymous said...: "But your own biases are clouding your view that there are hundreds of incidences in the past 24 month of union members doing it."

Hello, neomom, I am acknowledging this fact. But I will not buy into your generalization that all unions are thugs, just like I refuse to generalize that all Tea Partiers are racist, uneducated fools. Again, when a person's livelihood is at stake, they will make a statement. Hundreds of incidences? Of union members murdering people? Overly dramatic.; 8/20/2011 11:57 AM
Dad29 said...: Anony 1147....

If you weren't so damn busy trying to make points, you could actually read what I WROTE.

See, e.g., my 1045 on this string. Or see, e.g., my post yesterday addressing Sykes' complaints about recalls.; 8/20/2011 11:58 AM
neomom said...: Sorry Anony - I did Bing "Tea Party Violence" and the entire first page was about your ridiculous meme of the "tone".

Again. Words. Not one person was harmed by the words.

The unions have engaged in actual violence, sabbotage, and intimidation.

I also don't expect my employer to seek my input in salary and benefits. If I don't like what I am being offered, I will put myself back out on the job market - as I have done a few times previously. It is called employment at will.; 8/20/2011 12:14 PM
Anonymous said...: Dad29, you must have meant 10:05, you have no 10:45 post.

And damn straight I'm making points!

neomom--...your ridiculous meme of the "tone".

Care to expound on that point rather than set aside my arguments? I'm only responding to your (and Amy's) statements.

And if you happened to read the stories, there are specific examples of Tea Party violence. Conduct the google search, and there even more instances. Just stop kidding yourself and playing the "blame game".

It has nothing to do with "who is committing acts of violence right now", it has everything to do with "acts of violence are being committed".

"If I don't like what I am being offered..."

And what happens when employers decide to make those offers "you don't like" across the board and permanent??? It certainly has happened once in our history, and it can definitely occur again.; 8/20/2011 3:28 PM

Dad29

Wednesday, August 17, 2011

Another $1 Million in Capitol Security?

31 comments:

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